Rachel Rowland is on a mission to help parents be more intentional in their parenting and relationship choices. She practices an everyday bravery, struggles with demons of doubt, and believes wholeheartedly parents can be both powerful leaders in the workplace and connected parents at home.
Originally published Dec 16, 2018
Transcript link (uncorrected machine translation)
Rachel Rowland is on a mission to help parents be more intentional in their parenting and relationship choices. She practices an everyday bravery, struggles with demons of doubt, and believes wholeheartedly parents can be both powerful leaders in the workplace and connected parents at home.
[00:00:09] Welcome back to the I Am Virago podcast, where we get real about the struggle, drop the occasional F-bomb, and hear how amazing Virago women imperfectly navigate the world around them.
[00:00:19] Today's guest, Rachel Rowland, is on a mission to help parents be more
intentional in their parenting and relationship choices. A mother of three children,
Rachel works daily to state present recognized parenting bias, engage without
assumptions and practices every day, bravery while raising a family. She believes you
can't have it all, but you can have what you want.
[00:00:45] So grab that cup of ambition. Let's get started.
[00:00:50] Rachel Rowland. And to pay the bills, I rely on my tenacity and the strength
to keep me Jogi every day. I'm really passionate about supporting women come from a
place that is truly authentic and conscious to who they are such that they can kick ass in
the world and a little bit with their children and just the light sprinkle on top a little bit with
their children kick in the ass of children's not you know, it's not politely spoken about.
But what I mean is, you know, take control and make choices that really serve them in
all that they do sting.
[00:01:27] So can you just tell us a little bit more about what it is that you do?
[00:01:32] I'm a coach and I specialize in women's leadership, particularly thinking
about feminine energy and how we as women stand in authenticity amongst the reality
that exists, the biases that the real world we live in is. Those are my kind of, I guess,
interest projects in the coaching work that I do. I am also writing a book because I really
love words.
[00:02:00] I got a lot to say, so it seems a good way to get it out. My part time job is
looking after three children. Oh, and how old are your children? Seven five and one
seven five in one day.
[00:02:13] That's a spread is a full time job. And I you know, I'm detecting an accent.
How are you? I am. I am. So where are you from and where do you live today?
[00:02:27] I'm a South Londoner and I currently live in iskra on the beautiful West Coast.
[00:02:35] Oh, and what brings you to Issaquah?
[00:02:38] I've never heard a pronounce so, so lovely before. Oh, really? Oh yes. How
else to say it? It sounds it's just it sounds so lovely with your accent.
[00:02:46] Thank you. I just love nature. It was all part of my relocation choice to be
more in nature.
[00:02:53] So to find somewhere that is so accessible to the city and also like I'm just
staring out my window looking at these amazing trees and humming birds and sort of
bobcat and my garden and just, you know, I can walk out of my front door into true
nature. That's nice.
[00:03:11] I like it. So tell me a little bit more about your book.
[00:03:15] It doesn't have a title, but it will be something like how to be powerful and be
a parent. And I feel an energy is required of women. And I feel that energy is alive in
them. Whether or not they actually parent. But as mothers we nurture and an archetype
of mothering.
[00:03:35] We are connected to a level of care and awareness of bringing life full. And
also cutting away and letting go of that does not serve us. And it's this is like the nature
connection.
[00:03:49] This is all about the natural rhythm of life. And it's from a really powerful case
that women know and it works for them when they tap into it. It's a natural source of
energy and a natural source of confidence for them. And it is not easy to parent and to
do that work, especially in a world that doesn't value it in the traditional ways that we
measure value. So it's all about like the archetypes of parenting and what that really
means, like not the academic study of it, but turning that into mother go co parenting
and emotional intelligence and what it takes to be the leader of a family and a leader of
yourself and have an impact in the world.
[00:04:30] I find that often when I speak with authors that the topic of the books,
especially nonfiction books, comes because of personal experiences. And so how
would you be willing to talk about what's led you to wanting to write this book?
[00:04:45] I'm on a journey of maybe I would even go so fast that my journey of self
acceptance, like I've always been a driven woman and had a very successful career
and used my drive to be a success in my work. And then through the journey of
parenting, discovered a. But I didn't realize the impact of how deeply and how
consistently I would want to be present for my children. And I couldn't let either go. I
couldn't not be present and connected and nurturing of my children. And I couldn't not
be driven and committed and kicking ass in my work. But the world doesn't easily allow
that for men or women.
[00:05:20] And I really believe that as adult humans, we have an opportunity to be both
connected parents and kickass leaders. And actually, it's responsibility as privileged
white, western, middle class people to really work out how we can work in a system that
serves brilliant parents and branded as a light topic.
[00:05:41] Yeah. Just like dinner time. We'll talk about it. But I'm the web, actually. You
just ask me about my experience. Well, that is my experience.
[00:05:48] I was at a level playing field, you know, unloving, powerful with my husband
when we started having children. And over the first five years or so of us being parents,
I made choices that effectively diminished my impact on the working world. And so I did
that consciously. But it was my choice to do that. And then a point at which I realized
that wasn't saving who I am. And I was struggling to have the impact I wanted in my
work. Had been out of the working world long enough to see that it wasn't just about the
work I did. It was also about how I chose to parent. So I had to do a huge in a journey
into why can't I not be there for my kids? Why can't I put them in daycare here or, you
know, cut corners there? And what is it that's really driving my choices to be the parent
and the personal I want to be. It brought me to America. It was part of our work life
balance as a couple. And those parents to want to be that as a family together. And my
choice to run my own business, you know, led into just consistent choices, all gathered
around flexibility around the parliament with myself first and then my family.
[00:06:55] It sounds like this is a deeply personal choice and that there isn't one cookie
cutter choice that works for everyone and it requires some deep in a reflection.
[00:07:06] Yeah, that's a great point. Thank you for raising it, because that's why I feel it
needs a book. It really is a personal journey and I think we're reluctant to accept that on
a wider scale. But it's the work that I really personally believe parents and not just
women need to do because there's no blueprint. Now, we are living in a world that
enables flexibility and enables really empowered choices for men and women and as
parents. But they're not going to come easily. They're not going to be given to us
because it's not easy for businesses to invest in flexibility, to invest in individual
solutions. But we need them to be those leaders and to be those parents. I think of it as
like everyday bravery, everyday conscious choices.
[00:07:48] And you mentioned this a bit earlier, white middle class. It would seem to me
that there are those who have more of an ability to make choices. And there are others
who don't enjoy that same level of privilege. Yeah. Have you done any work in that
area? No, I'd love to.
[00:08:11] And I believe it's really important to open our own personal perspective to the
role we play in maintaining a systemic bias. And I am only at the very beginning of
understanding that we're always learning.
[00:08:23] And it sounds like you're on that path and continuing the path that actually
really interests me.
[00:08:29] Is there some kind of a paradox in that? And you know this from the work that
you do around the like. You have this personal experience and you attract. Right. We all
know we're human driven to attract people like us. But yet then within the opportunity is
that expanding our range and the edges of conversation and not working with people
who are actually like us. So that's the conscious choice to both be a change to and
comfortable with who we are such that we do work and have the greatest impact with
people like us. And then also. And yet to be really mindful of open and willing to be
vulnerable around all those parts that we must just be blind to.
[00:09:08] All we can do is assume that we don't know.
[00:09:10] And, you know, working with our assumption, working with that assumption, if
we could all do that. My gosh, what would the world be like?
[00:09:18] Right. And impeccable with your words. Right. Those are my two. Gosh,
they're my favorite.
[00:09:23] So it sounds like you have quite a bit going on in your world. Is there a
personal or professional win that you'd like to share with us? How?
[00:09:33] My personal win is not losing my cool very often. I, I have to tolerate a really
different pace with the work that I do than the one my nature wants to be working at and
to accept that and to be present for my kids and to be present for myself and to continue
to sort of surrender to the work that I do and the pace that comes such that I get to
really. And savor it and be present for my clients, which is have to be that's the paradox
of the work I do. I have to be really present for them such that they get to inspire and
enjoy their own journey. And yet there's so much work to do. I just like if I engage at all
with it like we are now in this conversation.
[00:10:16] There's so much work to be done. Okay, Janis, gotta go. Gotta go. Save the
world.
[00:10:20] So to not be driven, not to not allow that knowledge of all that there is to be
done to be in the driving seat is my everyday personal goal. Most days I'm doing all right
with it. It's been a long journey together.
[00:10:36] And what are some things you've done to help you get there?
[00:10:39] I think the biggest the most important one is knowing how to tune in to
yourself. For some people, that's meditation. For me is meditation. For others, it's a
practice of mindfulness that's maybe walking or swimming or exercising and moving the
body in some way. And for me as well, that there's a huge importance of the breath
tuning into how and when to use the breast. And literally, like some days, I feel like I'm
consciously breathing like every three minutes. Fair enough. It's easy to reject that stuff.
All the work is, you know, it's a lifetime's work. The grace and strength of mindfulness.
It's a huge part for me and it takes discipline. And every time you let it go. Coming back
and forgiving yourself and being retrained and learning how to stay tuned. Then also
being really clear with myself about my boundaries and consciously discussing and
sharing them with my partner particularly, and say that he supports me and I permit him
to like wave flags at me.
[00:11:39] You know, you seem a little tense and you know how those things can in the
wrong way really become a red flag. Right. So it's like open runnable, difficult
conversation about how do I do with my stress and how does it affect you and all this
incredible relationship work that goes into being really vulnerable with things, you know,
such that they can support you to be one.
[00:12:04] So it doesn't sound easy. No. Which leads us to the personal or professional
struggle that you've had recently that you might want to share with us.
[00:12:13] Yeah, getting out. I read the day that the true key to successful people is
talent plus energy. It really rang true with me because I know that when you have just
the talent, you could be right. But you have to have the energy with which to be present
and connect to the energy and allow others to understand it. And you could just be full
of energy and putting it out there. But if you've got new talent, ultimately, it's probably
going to not survive. And the energy it takes to get yourself out there. For me to leave
this room that I'm sitting here talking to, you be out there in the world connecting with
people in a way that does myself. Justice is is hard because it's lonely to be an author.
Even coaching has a level of like you're connecting with people, but you're really of
service to them. So you have to really look after yourself as a business owner. Oh, my
gosh.
[00:13:04] You know that the demons that can get a hold of your demons of doubt
around the way that you do. So it's about managing all those doubts such that you can
get out there every day and do some soul.
[00:13:14] So following on on that those demons of a doubt, you know what what what
is one area that you're really looking to improve on right now and in what are you doing
towards that goal of improvement?
[00:13:26] I am convinced that I make up all my own stress.
[00:13:32] I'm working on a hypothesis that I don't need to have any stress in my life.
And I've been using the word stress, create stress. So I am connected to really tuning in
to what's really going on here for me now and taking responsibility for what I can. My
own thoughts, my own actions, and trying to let go of everything that is not within my
control, which is basically everything outside of myself. There's the rub. When you got
kids, right, because they feel like they're part of you. But even they are not within my
control. So they are integral into my identity. They are integral to who I am. And yet I
can't control them. So how do I manage my thoughts and my actions such that I am
being true to myself and not losing myself in something that I cannot control?
[00:14:22] I think if you can figure this out, you may you might make a billion dollars. But
this is the thing is every personal journey to find authors, find podcasts, find people
inspiring you.
[00:14:33] And what I think this is, is, you know, a great mutual friend of ours is used as
a tool for getting hold of the elephant. I got the title. I got the ear, like just describing this
big, huge beast and all part of it. And that's what the book's about, is like I just know one
way and the way I've done it, but I have to move to a place where I believe it's good
enough that someone else might benefit because we just have to start sharing how as
women we find our way through these. Charted waters, and we're all maybe moving in
the center. Definitely. We're meeting in the same direction and maybe we're even
working on the same thing. Maybe I'm getting hold of the same air you are, but I feel it in
a different way. And if I can let you in on how I feel it, you might also be able to go to it,
even if it's not the same feeling.
[00:15:16] It's just, oh, you feel about it this way. I actually feel about it this way and it's
different. But you recognize that there's something to be feeling. Absolutely. So I adjust
this question a little bit for you specifically. Usually ask what would. Advice would you
have for young women getting to their careers? But what nice would you have for
women who are considering having children who have careers right now?
[00:15:43] I love that question because it's so important that we work out. The answer to
that question is for each of us. And I know that you have the power to choose every
single thing from this moment on is your choice, whether you go part time or you don't
go part time, whether you sleep with the child in your bed or let the child cry out,
whether you breastfeed or you don't, whether you have a great and intimate relationship
with your partner or you don't. All these things contribute the way we do, and I think is
the way we do everything. And they all contribute to this final picture of this, make
believe we're sold, make believe that you can have incredible job, an incredible
relationship, an incredible house, beautiful, meaningful connection with your kids and it
not be hard work. Everybody is working hard in some way or other, and you're going to
have to make some really difficult choices. So the better you get at making choices, the
more enjoyable that journey is going to be because it can be enjoyable. But you can't
have it all. You can have what you want and you got to work out what you want to a
man. Hallelujah.
[00:16:48] I'm inspired.
[00:16:50] I you just you know, I like thinking of myself sat in these big corporate training
rooms. Right. You know, truly on a level playing field with these incredible people of all
different ethnicities and genders. And the one common thing was our age and our
ambition. And I look back and I think about that person. And I just was so unaware how
outside of myself I put the responsibility for success like this thing I had in my head of
success that was being sold by them. You know, it was gonna come because I
deserved it. All of those things were true. It would come on. I did deserve it, but it wasn't
gonna be given to me. And I was a hard lesson to learn. And I'm really passionate about
women starting as soon as they possibly can. And what exactly what starting what a
realization that we all humans are culturally raised with biases that limits our potential
once we are in long term relationships. As parents, we bring a huge history of parenting
bias that informs who we are on our journey through adulthood. And we have not yet
resolved our opportunities in the workplace with opportunities to be true co parents.
We're planning like what the baby names are going to be and what the nursery is going
to look like more than how are we really going to get this child to daycare for seven, 30
in the morning and pick it up at six at night and hold on a minute. Is that what we want?
Is that the parents we want to be. We're all assuming that someone else is going to do it
and while they do it, don't know. So we must it must be okay. Well, no, actually, we
have a conversation with them. They're finding it really hard.
[00:18:26] I love I love your passion. I suspect that there are going to be many people
out there very excited to hear these ideas come up so that they can even open a
dialogue and have a conversation because they're it sounds like there's just so much
assuming going on out there.
[00:18:41] And, you know, what's wonderful is actually I don't I'm not fortunate enough
to know a huge number of very young men. Not the life I lead these days. But I believe
that people go into relationships now. And I'm particularly talking about heterosexual
relationships. Right, because I am just gonna own that upfront, because this is gender
bias that comes up when we're talking about boys and girls.
[00:19:03] That's just the way it is. Right. Not that all the other models don't have their
challenges, but the model of heterosexual parenting is, I see the most challenging one
because we've got all these hidden assumptions that you say don't get discussed in that
model. I believe that men and women want this stay one. To have both of them want to
have meaningful careers and meaningful connection with each other and their kids.
We've got this opportunity to shape it. But, yeah, that's the key. As you say that the
opportunity for vulnerable conversation.
[00:19:35] So Rachel Sonic's you have a Rago. I really love kicking ass. Tell me more.
[00:19:45] I really love being so truthful because truth is freedom. You know what's
really going on here.
[00:19:55] And I that's how I want to use my power is to turn that. To message that can
be received. See and feel and know the truth from sources that are not always used as
sources of reliable information, but I know reliable sources of information use it to
generate a truth that people cannot ignore.
[00:20:18] Wow. I love it. So we're getting towards the end now. So any any parting
words for our listening audience?
[00:20:28] I'm thinking about keeping the faith. Keep the faith. Keep coming from a
place of consistent energy that is true to who you are because no one else like you.
This is such an overused thing about, you know, no one else can be you. But the
consistency is key. How do you be consistently you every day. Keep the faith. Keep the
faith.
[00:20:50] All right, Rachel, thank you so much for your time and really appreciate it,
Senator. And I'm excited to read your book. Maybe we'll have you back on when you've
published your book.
[00:21:01] Oh, here's to that. See? Cheers. All right. Thank you. Thank you.
[00:21:09] Thank you, my Viragos, for listening to the I Am Virago podcast. Check out new episodes every Tuesday. If you have ideas or suggestions of whom you'd like to hear from on this podcast, go to IAmVirago.com and leave a message. And remember, you are Virago.